[WMCEE-l] WMCEE-l Digest, Vol 32, Issue 8
Renessaince
renessaince at gmail.com
Sun Nov 16 21:10:34 CET 2014
Hello, Bal?zs Viczi?n and everyone.
>
>
> *3) Russian-related (RUS-UKR-BLR-KAZ+wherever a sizable Russian minority
> lives,like the Baltic states plus maybe even as far countries as ISR and
> the USA)*
>
Hey, what do You mean "russian-related"? I have ever known more polite term
"Eastern Slavs" (w/o Kazakhstan evidently).
2014-11-16 14:00 GMT+03:00 <wmcee-l-request at tools.wikimedia.pl>:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: What the meeting is good for? (Bal?zs Viczi?n)
> 2. Re: link (Bal?zs Viczi?n)
> 3. Re: What the meeting is good for? (Tomasz Ganicz)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 08:03:58 +0000
> From: Bal?zs Viczi?n <balazs.viczian at wikimedia.hu>
> To: A list for Wikimedians from Central and Eastern Europe
> <wmcee-l at tools.wikimedia.pl>
> Subject: Re: [WMCEE-l] What the meeting is good for?
> Message-ID:
> <
> CAFbLRb9xrT4+Qt-Fw-VY2pN9j2u8COsOkoChCuyd3XXaJgaHPg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Laura,
>
> Iberocoop is a culturally homogeneous community with no language
> difficulties at all between its members. It can be best compared maybe to
> the UK's Commonwealth.
>
> Or imagine a cooperation between the UK-USA-SA-AUS-NZ-IRL-CAN and other
> closely related "English-first" countries.
>
> The CEE region in contrary can be divided into at least 4 (or more)
> distinct groups:
>
> 1) North Slavic (CZ-SK-POL),
> 2) South Savic (CRO-SLO-RS-BIH-MAC-BUL)
> 3) Russian-related (RUS-UKR-BLR-KAZ+wherever a sizable Russian minority
> lives,like the Baltic states plus maybe even as far countries as ISR and
> the USA)
> 4) Baltics (EST-LAT-LV)
> 5) Caucasus (ARM-GEO-AZE and Caucasaian Russia, -Iran, -Turkey)
>
> and others, like ROM-MOL, ALB-KOS or HUN with the sizable Hungarian
> minorities in the neighbouring countries, or GRE-CYP or Turkey(-North
> Cyprus-AZE) or others without a country (Sorbians, Rusyns, Sami, etc) and
> the many-many more I missed listing here (one example: the Finno-Ugric
> cooperation of FIN-HUN-EST+many ethnic groups without a country)
>
> The only "real" similarity is the Soviet/Communist history (but not for
> all) what actually almost everybody who had wants to get rid of (and what
> made most of those CEE countries look similar on the surface) and of course
> the geo-location.
>
> I understand that from the UK these countries might look very similar but
> beleive me, they are not.
>
> Apart from being roughly at the same part of the map if you zoom out enough
> (Budapest and Astana are 4500 kms away from each other...exact same
> distance as Lisbon-Moscow)
>
> And I have not even mentioned the history yet what gives a CZ-SK
> cooperation far better chances of success than for example a CRO-RS one
> (not to say examples like AZE-ARM...)
>
> Chapters would probably cooperate better than the general population
> though, however ignoring all mentioned above could lead to painful fails.
>
> Me being from Hungary have not much in common with lets say the Kazakhs due
> to the physical, linguistic and cultural distances we have between us.
>
> It is _absolutely not_ a bad thing just a simple fact. We are too different
> and too far away from each other (in all means) to find easy ways to
> cooperate (if we will ever try to...)
>
> Probably instead of pushing a single "CEE-coop" it would be better to let
> those "natural groups" be created. (Note, many countries would belong to
> more than one group but on different levels and depths what cold help
> create more focused cooperations).
>
> Bal?zs
> 2014.11.15. 8:55, "Laura Hale" <laura at fanhistory.com> ezt ?rta:
>
> > To accomplish goals, to be better integrated into the wider community, to
> > help build the global Wikimedia brand for your own benefit, to get better
> > access to grants, to find other partners in chapters to do projects with,
> > to teach others what you have learned to be successful, to learn from
> > others what they have done to be successful, to alert others to important
> > copyright issues facing your local community, to better lobby on reforms
> > related to open access to information, etc.
> >
> > Improving visibility in a positive way is about improving collaboration.
> > Collaboration is at the heart of all Wikimedia projects, and what makes
> it
> > successful. Often, you need face to face to do that.
> >
> > At the end of the day, you can argue go it alone all you want. What
> > success has this strategy of going alone brought you? Why is eschewing
> > collaboration in this case the better option? Why is not working with
> > others a better road to success for your chapter or your Wikimedia
> project?
> >
> > Sincerely,
> > Laura Hale
> >
> > On Saturday, November 15, 2014, Juan de Vojn?kov <
> juandevojnikov at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> And why we have to improve the visibility of wmcee comunity?
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> > --
> > twitter: purplepopple
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > WMCEE-l mailing list
> > WMCEE-l at tools.wikimedia.pl
> > http://tools.wikimedia.pl/mailman/listinfo/wmcee-l
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 09:03:51 +0000
> From: Bal?zs Viczi?n <balazs.viczian at wikimedia.hu>
> To: A list for Wikimedians from Central and Eastern Europe
> <wmcee-l at tools.wikimedia.pl>
> Subject: Re: [WMCEE-l] link
> Message-ID:
> <CAFbLRb8JCMEhbVTKDmbBXv9=_
> ej8_ZN3K1eWoAfkm0xFADCUKg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi,
>
> Sorry to say, I feel it is too late now for this; rather have a separate
> CEE meeting/preconf day in Zurich at the chapters conf or have it in
> February/March as the proposed dates are only 2-4 weeks from today.
>
> Travelling would be much more expensive and possibly more complicated (the
> further people coming from the more possible that many direct flights are
> fully booked by now forcing people to change planes or change more than
> once or take longer routes) than having it 2-3 months from today.
>
> Bal?zs
> >
> > 2014.11.11. 8:19, "Levon Azizian" <levonazizian at bigmir.net> ezt ?rta:
> >>
> >> Dear friends, some of you mentioned that poll link in the previous
> letter is not available. Due to this I'm mentioning the link as a text:
> goo.gl/forms/ZozAWFrMXl
> >>
> >> Thank you for reacting and participation!
> >>
> >> Below is available the full text of letter.
> >>
> >> From: Levon Azizian <levonazizian at bigmir.net>
> >> Date: 2014-11-10 5:05 GMT+02:00
> >> Subject: [WMCEE-l] CEEM-2014 in Ukraine
> >> To: wmcee-l at tools.wikimedia.pl
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi everybody!
> >>
> >>
> After long discussions, just an hour ago, our chapter has decided to
> host CEEM-2014 in Ukraine. Due to several reasons (including transport
> connection and residence of the team members) we decided to prepare
> the event in Kyiv. It is really necessary from you to mention suitable
> dates of the meeting, so we're kindly asking you to fill the FORM.
> >>
> >> FAQ:
> >>
> - the draft of agenda will be available in 48 hours (if you have
> wishes, we can include them);
> >> - the question of scholarship will be solved as soon as it's possible;
> >> - the dates of the meeting will be confirmed in one week;
> >>
> - the address of the CEEM-2014 in Kyiv will be announced approximately
> in two weeks.
> >>
> >> The members of the team are:
> >> - User:Antanana
> >> - User:NickK
> >> - User:Visem
> >> - and me (User:????????)
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> Levon Azizian
> >> Deputy chair
> >> Wikimedia Ukraine
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> WMCEE-l mailing list
> >> WMCEE-l at tools.wikimedia.pl
> >> http://tools.wikimedia.pl/mailman/listinfo/wmcee-l
> >>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 10:45:02 +0100
> From: Tomasz Ganicz <polimerek at gmail.com>
> To: A list for Wikimedians from Central and Eastern Europe
> <wmcee-l at tools.wikimedia.pl>
> Subject: Re: [WMCEE-l] What the meeting is good for?
> Message-ID:
> <CAF-oDcsHZ=
> WvXNr5i5Va6-DR8fcijb_mki81qS6bWd+ayDpBrA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Yes.. and the pardox of the situation is that the only "lingua franca"
> for the teritory is actually English :-) + some countries are at the
> war at the moment or they have been quite recently.
>
>
> 2014-11-16 9:03 GMT+01:00 Bal?zs Viczi?n <balazs.viczian at wikimedia.hu>:
> > Laura,
> >
> > Iberocoop is a culturally homogeneous community with no language
> > difficulties at all between its members. It can be best compared maybe to
> > the UK's Commonwealth.
> >
> > Or imagine a cooperation between the UK-USA-SA-AUS-NZ-IRL-CAN and other
> > closely related "English-first" countries.
> >
> > The CEE region in contrary can be divided into at least 4 (or more)
> distinct
> > groups:
> >
> > 1) North Slavic (CZ-SK-POL),
> > 2) South Savic (CRO-SLO-RS-BIH-MAC-BUL)
> > 3) Russian-related (RUS-UKR-BLR-KAZ+wherever a sizable Russian minority
> > lives,like the Baltic states plus maybe even as far countries as ISR and
> the
> > USA)
> > 4) Baltics (EST-LAT-LV)
> > 5) Caucasus (ARM-GEO-AZE and Caucasaian Russia, -Iran, -Turkey)
> >
> > and others, like ROM-MOL, ALB-KOS or HUN with the sizable Hungarian
> > minorities in the neighbouring countries, or GRE-CYP or Turkey(-North
> > Cyprus-AZE) or others without a country (Sorbians, Rusyns, Sami, etc) and
> > the many-many more I missed listing here (one example: the Finno-Ugric
> > cooperation of FIN-HUN-EST+many ethnic groups without a country)
> >
> > The only "real" similarity is the Soviet/Communist history (but not for
> all)
> > what actually almost everybody who had wants to get rid of (and what made
> > most of those CEE countries look similar on the surface) and of course
> the
> > geo-location.
> >
> > I understand that from the UK these countries might look very similar but
> > beleive me, they are not.
> >
> > Apart from being roughly at the same part of the map if you zoom out
> enough
> > (Budapest and Astana are 4500 kms away from each other...exact same
> distance
> > as Lisbon-Moscow)
> >
> > And I have not even mentioned the history yet what gives a CZ-SK
> cooperation
> > far better chances of success than for example a CRO-RS one (not to say
> > examples like AZE-ARM...)
> >
> > Chapters would probably cooperate better than the general population
> though,
> > however ignoring all mentioned above could lead to painful fails.
> >
> > Me being from Hungary have not much in common with lets say the Kazakhs
> due
> > to the physical, linguistic and cultural distances we have between us.
> >
> > It is _absolutely not_ a bad thing just a simple fact. We are too
> different
> > and too far away from each other (in all means) to find easy ways to
> > cooperate (if we will ever try to...)
> >
> > Probably instead of pushing a single "CEE-coop" it would be better to let
> > those "natural groups" be created. (Note, many countries would belong to
> > more than one group but on different levels and depths what cold help
> create
> > more focused cooperations).
> >
> > Bal?zs
> >
> > 2014.11.15. 8:55, "Laura Hale" <laura at fanhistory.com> ezt ?rta:
> >>
> >> To accomplish goals, to be better integrated into the wider community,
> to
> >> help build the global Wikimedia brand for your own benefit, to get
> better
> >> access to grants, to find other partners in chapters to do projects
> with, to
> >> teach others what you have learned to be successful, to learn from
> others
> >> what they have done to be successful, to alert others to important
> copyright
> >> issues facing your local community, to better lobby on reforms related
> to
> >> open access to information, etc.
> >>
> >> Improving visibility in a positive way is about improving collaboration.
> >> Collaboration is at the heart of all Wikimedia projects, and what makes
> it
> >> successful. Often, you need face to face to do that.
> >>
> >> At the end of the day, you can argue go it alone all you want. What
> >> success has this strategy of going alone brought you? Why is eschewing
> >> collaboration in this case the better option? Why is not working with
> >> others a better road to success for your chapter or your Wikimedia
> project?
> >>
> >> Sincerely,
> >> Laura Hale
> >>
> >> On Saturday, November 15, 2014, Juan de Vojn?kov
> >> <juandevojnikov at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> And why we have to improve the visibility of wmcee comunity?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> twitter: purplepopple
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> WMCEE-l mailing list
> >> WMCEE-l at tools.wikimedia.pl
> >> http://tools.wikimedia.pl/mailman/listinfo/wmcee-l
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > WMCEE-l mailing list
> > WMCEE-l at tools.wikimedia.pl
> > http://tools.wikimedia.pl/mailman/listinfo/wmcee-l
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Tomek "Polimerek" Ganicz
> http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Polimerek
> http://www.ganicz.pl/poli/
> http://www.cbmm.lodz.pl/work.php?id=29&title=tomasz-ganicz
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
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> WMCEE-l mailing list
> WMCEE-l at tools.wikimedia.pl
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of WMCEE-l Digest, Vol 32, Issue 8
> **************************************
>
--
Усё будзе добра. Дзень прыйдзе новы.
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